Talk:Money and Merchants: Difference between revisions

From Epic Path
Jump to navigation Jump to search
No edit summary
No edit summary
 
(11 intermediate revisions by 2 users not shown)
Line 1: Line 1:
Re-scale gold limits, DC's and other elements
__NOTOC__


  the re-scale mentioned above is getting increasingly urgent, the current coffer limits and such are just wrong. it would be nice to tie this to the treasure rules directly, so if we tinker it cascades to here as well.
Add in non-settlement Merchants (predefine several and allow GM's to add more)
 
== Settlements ==
We need to have a concrete understanding of "Why Settlements Matter" in mind before we start making any rules. In my opinion, we need two completely different systems that focus on different things, but can interact with each other in a mechanically consistent fashion.
 
==== GM-Run Settlements ====
The purpose of a GM-run settlement is to advance the story of the campaign.  This is accomplished by making one or more settlements that contain interesting NPC's, potential allies, potential and actual threats, and they also establish some interesting 'set pieces' for future encounters/fights/battles.  Secondarily, they should paint a picture of a culture or society that is interesting, internally-consistent, and hopefully, evocative of some new ideas that the players haven't seen in real life. While there should be room for GM's to invest some time in descriptions, NPCs, and the like, the 'bones' of the settlement should be VERY easy to generate.  Ideally, any system we come up with should work for creating a town/village/city, and work basically the same for creating a kingdom, empire, or domain.
 
<div style="margin-left:1.5em">
=====Minimum Story Elements for a GM-run settlement=====
* leadership - creates a list of npc's, and establishes a general feel of the governance of the region to the visitors and inhabitants
* attitude towards neighbors, especially player-run settlement(s)
* adventure hooks - local dungeons, cults, dangerous areas, points of interest, etc., where adventuring can occur.
* unique advantages - something that can only be had in this location, that justify why the players might travel here. Examples include a monopoly on a certain class of magic item, a McGuffin, a potential ally or ally group, etc.


complicated. I'll take a stab at this and you can let me know what you think.
=====Minimum Crunch Elements for a GM-run settlement=====
* attitude - the diplomatic rating between this settlement and the player-run settlement. Ratings should also exist with each of the settlement's neighbors (typically, this is a number between -10 and 10) - secret until learned
* military might - how many units, and what quality they possess - secret
* military preparedness - how ready the military is to attack or defend - usually not secret
* intrigue - the potency of intrigue actions performed by this settlement (how good they are at their jobs) - secret
* counter-intrigue - resources allocated to defending against intrigue attempts made against the settlement - secret
* settlement size (puts hard limits on the above elements, and also dictates things like magic item availability, etc.) - not secret
* settlement growth rate - how quickly the settlement will increase in size - not secret
</div>


  I like the bones of it. we can go with it, and say that thorps have a travelling merchant (to justify the high numbers) and those prices are only available when the travelling tinker is in town.  otherwise, the scaling factor works just fine.
At a minimum, GM-run settlements exist as an opportunity to either engage in battle (warfare-scale battles) against their military, an opportunity to glean secrets (via intrigue), and an opportunity to sabotage (or be sabotaged by; again via intrigue).
 
Depending on how we design our warfare system, exact military composition should be a secret (that can be learned via intrigue), but large events like mustering on a particular border can't be kept secret.
 
==== Player-Run Settlements ====
The purpose of player-run settlements is to give the players more to do. This has to be achieved by making the settlement-management interesting and rewarding, but without unbalancing the game or bogging it down.  A player-run settlement should not be a source of income, but instead a source of temporary advantages, information gathering, and an instrument the players can wield at the scale of influencing GM-run settlements.  Everything else should be abstracted, (e.g. it doesn't really matter whether the road is dirt or cobblestone, if it doesn't give a useful advantage to the players).
 
<div style="margin-left:1.5em">
=====Minimum Story Elements for a player-run settlement=====
* Location and points of interest, adventure hooks, etc.
* Unique advantages - this could be as minor as "it's a place you can build", but could be more meaningful to the campaign than that.
 
=====Minimum Crunch Elements for a player-run settlement=====
I see two major ways we could do player-run settlements:
* 1) Each player chooses a role or organization that they run and manage, and the whole of the various organizations combine into the settlement, and what it does each settlement-turn (this would be harder to design, but might be more satisfying to play with as a player, since everyone's individual actions would always be meaningful).
:* examples would include things like: temples, town hall/governor, thief's guild, town watch/military, etc.
:* if multiple players want to co-manage a single organization, they could just accomplish more each turn for that organization than if just a single player were running it
* 2) All players make decisions for the settlement as a group, and vote on how things should be done each settlement-turn.  differences in opinion just mean that effort is split among those options that were voted on.  For example, if there are three major actions: growth, intrigue, or military, each member of the group can assign their vote die (probably a d6 or a d8) to the category of their choice, and only those dice can be spent on those actions during that settlement turn. (this would be simpler to design, take up less game time to resolve, but should still lead to meaningful results.)
:* within each major category, there would be sub-activities that the dice could then modify:
::* intrigue - includes all information gathering activities, such as learning the specific details of a neighbor's military composition, learning the attitude of a neighbor towards either your own, or a different settlement, scouting for new points of interest or unique settlement qualities (either in the local settlement or in neighboring settlements), sabotage activities (weakening a particular military unit, lowering preparedness, lowering settlement growth rate).  Cannot be used to directly reduce the size of a settlement (that would only be done through actual warfare), nor can it be used to assassinate any key figures (that would require adventurers doing adventures), or anything else that should be done as heroes going out and doing it themselves.
:::* intrigue assets - special NPCs with names. When the players take the 'increase intrigue potency' action, they can use it to improve an existing NPC asset's overall competence (NOT level; they don't have a level), or allow for another special NPC to be recruited.  Failed missions don't usually result in the loss of an asset (although a high enough counter-intrigue score should make it possible to capture or kill a hostile asset), just that the mission doesn't accomplish its goal.  Multiple assets can either be sent on the same mission (giving an assist bonus to their check) or different missions.  Dice in the pool that turn that were assigned to assist with the mission (and not assigned to growth), can be used to modify the mission result.  Each mission check is a single d20 roll against the target settlement's Counter-Intrigue score.  Dice in the pool can only affect a single d20 check.
::* growth - increasing growth rate of the settlement.  Once the settlement size increases, that increase can be spent to either increase the military's size, the ability to support more advanced military units, increase which intrigue actions are available, or increase the size of the intrigue network (allowing multiple intrigue actions per settlement-turn).  Note that neither military, intrigue, nor growth 'dice pools' have limits.  The limits from size don't affect how many dice can be spent, only how much of an end-result can be achieved.  Thus, it's easier to muster a small army, but harder to muster a large army, unless your settlement is also large.
::* military - muster new units (always start as irregulars with no experience), equip a unit (upgrading them to militia, cavalry, or artillery), or increase preparedness.  Preparedness is always useful for defense, but once it reaches a certain threshold, you can 'spend' it to make an attack against a neighboring settlement (this is why having an enemy sabotage your preparedness is bad).
</div>
 
==strongholds (optional)==
* each player may choose to build a stronghold for their base of operations.
:* stronghold might be a keep, a mage's tower, an apothecary, a guild hall, a functioning business that is really a front for a guild hall, etc. This is only important for RP reasons.
:* strongholds can be related to the owner's profession-based business (if any), or not; may be convenient for them to be one thing, or better if they're separate.  This is only important for RP reasons.
* generally, strongholds can't be shared, unless there's a clear leadership role for each 'owner'; in that case, GM's may allow a shared space, but each 'owner' would still need to invest the full amount (no discounts).
* strongholds cost both money and time to build
* strongholds can be leveled up (costing more time and money). If a shared stronghold, each owner's portion is leveled up separately.
:* benefit 1: strongholds offer a home base (a safe place to stay) for the owner and any guests they wish to entertain.
::* grant a lifestyle, which improves based on level of stronghold.
:* benefit 2: strongholds reduce the cost and time required for other character retraining activities
::* in game-design terms, the goal would be that this is roughly a break-even proposition, in terms of initial investment to overall benefit. However, campaigns with more downtime would probably see a net positive from this benefit, while campaigns with little downtime would see a net loss.
:::* higher level strongholds grant better bonuses to this.
:* benefit 3: strongholds grant one or more henchmen/minions, which can be tasked with performing missions for the stronghold's owner
::* these missions take time, but not money, and occur concurrently with any adventuring or downtime; any time passing advances this progress.
::* missions might include:
:::* running things to turn a profit' (making money)
:::* finding rare crafting materials or remnants
:::* creating a magic item for the owning player
:::* researching a spell for the owning player
:::* making a contract with a foreign power (diplomacy/trade/etc.)
::* minions, when gained, are assigned a role: accountant, mercenary, researcher, ambassador (may be others)
::* role grants them a bonus to certain types of missions, and penalties to others, but any minion can always do any assignment.   
::* missions take a certain allotment of time; once time has passed, a single roll is made to determine degree of success.
:::* complete success - desired outcome occurs
:::* partial success - most of the desired outcome occurs, with some downside as well (injured minion, less gains from mission, mission takes longer, etc.)
:::* failure - no gains; time wasted, but otherwise no bad results
:::* abject failure - no gains, and bad outcome. Could be permanent loss of minion, or loss of reputation from some agency or power, etc.
::* higher level strongholds grant more minions; minions can be tasked independently, or teamed up to improve success chances or reduce time required.
 
* depending on the campaign, the multiple strongholds of a party might constitute important parts of the local government, or even be the core elements of a city, nation, or empire.


Add in non-settlement Merchants (predefine several and allow GM's to add more)


==settlement stuff==
=== Older Notes ===
* economy - how much trade, how strong the guilds are, how self-sufficient the town is
* economy - how much trade, how strong the guilds are, how self-sufficient the town is



Latest revision as of 15:49, 27 December 2020


Add in non-settlement Merchants (predefine several and allow GM's to add more)

Settlements

We need to have a concrete understanding of "Why Settlements Matter" in mind before we start making any rules. In my opinion, we need two completely different systems that focus on different things, but can interact with each other in a mechanically consistent fashion.

GM-Run Settlements

The purpose of a GM-run settlement is to advance the story of the campaign. This is accomplished by making one or more settlements that contain interesting NPC's, potential allies, potential and actual threats, and they also establish some interesting 'set pieces' for future encounters/fights/battles. Secondarily, they should paint a picture of a culture or society that is interesting, internally-consistent, and hopefully, evocative of some new ideas that the players haven't seen in real life. While there should be room for GM's to invest some time in descriptions, NPCs, and the like, the 'bones' of the settlement should be VERY easy to generate. Ideally, any system we come up with should work for creating a town/village/city, and work basically the same for creating a kingdom, empire, or domain.

Minimum Story Elements for a GM-run settlement
  • leadership - creates a list of npc's, and establishes a general feel of the governance of the region to the visitors and inhabitants
  • attitude towards neighbors, especially player-run settlement(s)
  • adventure hooks - local dungeons, cults, dangerous areas, points of interest, etc., where adventuring can occur.
  • unique advantages - something that can only be had in this location, that justify why the players might travel here. Examples include a monopoly on a certain class of magic item, a McGuffin, a potential ally or ally group, etc.
Minimum Crunch Elements for a GM-run settlement
  • attitude - the diplomatic rating between this settlement and the player-run settlement. Ratings should also exist with each of the settlement's neighbors (typically, this is a number between -10 and 10) - secret until learned
  • military might - how many units, and what quality they possess - secret
  • military preparedness - how ready the military is to attack or defend - usually not secret
  • intrigue - the potency of intrigue actions performed by this settlement (how good they are at their jobs) - secret
  • counter-intrigue - resources allocated to defending against intrigue attempts made against the settlement - secret
  • settlement size (puts hard limits on the above elements, and also dictates things like magic item availability, etc.) - not secret
  • settlement growth rate - how quickly the settlement will increase in size - not secret

At a minimum, GM-run settlements exist as an opportunity to either engage in battle (warfare-scale battles) against their military, an opportunity to glean secrets (via intrigue), and an opportunity to sabotage (or be sabotaged by; again via intrigue).

Depending on how we design our warfare system, exact military composition should be a secret (that can be learned via intrigue), but large events like mustering on a particular border can't be kept secret.

Player-Run Settlements

The purpose of player-run settlements is to give the players more to do. This has to be achieved by making the settlement-management interesting and rewarding, but without unbalancing the game or bogging it down. A player-run settlement should not be a source of income, but instead a source of temporary advantages, information gathering, and an instrument the players can wield at the scale of influencing GM-run settlements. Everything else should be abstracted, (e.g. it doesn't really matter whether the road is dirt or cobblestone, if it doesn't give a useful advantage to the players).

Minimum Story Elements for a player-run settlement
  • Location and points of interest, adventure hooks, etc.
  • Unique advantages - this could be as minor as "it's a place you can build", but could be more meaningful to the campaign than that.
Minimum Crunch Elements for a player-run settlement

I see two major ways we could do player-run settlements:

  • 1) Each player chooses a role or organization that they run and manage, and the whole of the various organizations combine into the settlement, and what it does each settlement-turn (this would be harder to design, but might be more satisfying to play with as a player, since everyone's individual actions would always be meaningful).
  • examples would include things like: temples, town hall/governor, thief's guild, town watch/military, etc.
  • if multiple players want to co-manage a single organization, they could just accomplish more each turn for that organization than if just a single player were running it
  • 2) All players make decisions for the settlement as a group, and vote on how things should be done each settlement-turn. differences in opinion just mean that effort is split among those options that were voted on. For example, if there are three major actions: growth, intrigue, or military, each member of the group can assign their vote die (probably a d6 or a d8) to the category of their choice, and only those dice can be spent on those actions during that settlement turn. (this would be simpler to design, take up less game time to resolve, but should still lead to meaningful results.)
  • within each major category, there would be sub-activities that the dice could then modify:
  • intrigue - includes all information gathering activities, such as learning the specific details of a neighbor's military composition, learning the attitude of a neighbor towards either your own, or a different settlement, scouting for new points of interest or unique settlement qualities (either in the local settlement or in neighboring settlements), sabotage activities (weakening a particular military unit, lowering preparedness, lowering settlement growth rate). Cannot be used to directly reduce the size of a settlement (that would only be done through actual warfare), nor can it be used to assassinate any key figures (that would require adventurers doing adventures), or anything else that should be done as heroes going out and doing it themselves.
  • intrigue assets - special NPCs with names. When the players take the 'increase intrigue potency' action, they can use it to improve an existing NPC asset's overall competence (NOT level; they don't have a level), or allow for another special NPC to be recruited. Failed missions don't usually result in the loss of an asset (although a high enough counter-intrigue score should make it possible to capture or kill a hostile asset), just that the mission doesn't accomplish its goal. Multiple assets can either be sent on the same mission (giving an assist bonus to their check) or different missions. Dice in the pool that turn that were assigned to assist with the mission (and not assigned to growth), can be used to modify the mission result. Each mission check is a single d20 roll against the target settlement's Counter-Intrigue score. Dice in the pool can only affect a single d20 check.
  • growth - increasing growth rate of the settlement. Once the settlement size increases, that increase can be spent to either increase the military's size, the ability to support more advanced military units, increase which intrigue actions are available, or increase the size of the intrigue network (allowing multiple intrigue actions per settlement-turn). Note that neither military, intrigue, nor growth 'dice pools' have limits. The limits from size don't affect how many dice can be spent, only how much of an end-result can be achieved. Thus, it's easier to muster a small army, but harder to muster a large army, unless your settlement is also large.
  • military - muster new units (always start as irregulars with no experience), equip a unit (upgrading them to militia, cavalry, or artillery), or increase preparedness. Preparedness is always useful for defense, but once it reaches a certain threshold, you can 'spend' it to make an attack against a neighboring settlement (this is why having an enemy sabotage your preparedness is bad).

strongholds (optional)

  • each player may choose to build a stronghold for their base of operations.
  • stronghold might be a keep, a mage's tower, an apothecary, a guild hall, a functioning business that is really a front for a guild hall, etc. This is only important for RP reasons.
  • strongholds can be related to the owner's profession-based business (if any), or not; may be convenient for them to be one thing, or better if they're separate. This is only important for RP reasons.
  • generally, strongholds can't be shared, unless there's a clear leadership role for each 'owner'; in that case, GM's may allow a shared space, but each 'owner' would still need to invest the full amount (no discounts).
  • strongholds cost both money and time to build
  • strongholds can be leveled up (costing more time and money). If a shared stronghold, each owner's portion is leveled up separately.
  • benefit 1: strongholds offer a home base (a safe place to stay) for the owner and any guests they wish to entertain.
  • grant a lifestyle, which improves based on level of stronghold.
  • benefit 2: strongholds reduce the cost and time required for other character retraining activities
  • in game-design terms, the goal would be that this is roughly a break-even proposition, in terms of initial investment to overall benefit. However, campaigns with more downtime would probably see a net positive from this benefit, while campaigns with little downtime would see a net loss.
  • higher level strongholds grant better bonuses to this.
  • benefit 3: strongholds grant one or more henchmen/minions, which can be tasked with performing missions for the stronghold's owner
  • these missions take time, but not money, and occur concurrently with any adventuring or downtime; any time passing advances this progress.
  • missions might include:
  • running things to turn a profit' (making money)
  • finding rare crafting materials or remnants
  • creating a magic item for the owning player
  • researching a spell for the owning player
  • making a contract with a foreign power (diplomacy/trade/etc.)
  • minions, when gained, are assigned a role: accountant, mercenary, researcher, ambassador (may be others)
  • role grants them a bonus to certain types of missions, and penalties to others, but any minion can always do any assignment.
  • missions take a certain allotment of time; once time has passed, a single roll is made to determine degree of success.
  • complete success - desired outcome occurs
  • partial success - most of the desired outcome occurs, with some downside as well (injured minion, less gains from mission, mission takes longer, etc.)
  • failure - no gains; time wasted, but otherwise no bad results
  • abject failure - no gains, and bad outcome. Could be permanent loss of minion, or loss of reputation from some agency or power, etc.
  • higher level strongholds grant more minions; minions can be tasked independently, or teamed up to improve success chances or reduce time required.
  • depending on the campaign, the multiple strongholds of a party might constitute important parts of the local government, or even be the core elements of a city, nation, or empire.


Older Notes

  • economy - how much trade, how strong the guilds are, how self-sufficient the town is
  • civics - presence of guards, ease of obeying rules, how common is crime?
  • morality - fairness of rules, expectations of bribery, bigotry/racism
  • lore - availability of libraries, how chatty the public is
  • alignment - friendliness, trustworthiness, willingness to help, community support


  • government type
  • autocracy
  • NPC trade skills, such as 'lumberjack' employ the use of lay magic, which grows substantially at higher levels of skill in their trade. A high level lumberjack can not only fell a tree in a single hit, he can explode the bark off of it and split it lengthwise, perfectly, with that hit. A highly advanced librarian can conjure a book from anywhere in their library, or even other, distant libraries they have relations with, simply by stating its title. A master constable can instantly sober someone up, strip someone of city buffs (or grant them) even without access to the city's founder's stone, can see someone's past convicted crimes simply by looking at them, etc. A high level city watch captain can identify spies and those who intend harm to their city simply by speaking with them for a minute or two. A master farmer can perform a daily ritual that doubles crop growth speed, enriches the soil, and doubles the harvest when it is ready to be sown, can cause livestock to breed faster and with greater health, etc.
  • 'drinking' leads to a condition stack, some of which are actually useful. this opens the idea of 'buff stations' in settlements, bars for drinks, back alleys for chicanery, pugilariums for fighting, libraries for smarts, temples for devoutness, etc. scaling of these things? ties into social events, festivals (Hale Winter, etc), formal balls, tavern parties, weddings, funerals, etc.
  • settlements (or locations within settlements) may lay a mandatory charge, overwriting any buffs the character may already have. In some cases, this is the town buff (assuming the target character is considered an ally), but in less friendly climates, it might simply be an empty charge, meant solely to negate buffs. Mandatory buffs are very expensive settlement features and are rarely found protecting a merchant's shop (except for the most prestigious and wealthy; and they might employ a charge that inflicts 'mellow' to facilitate sales; this is highly illegal in most places, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen).
  • a lot of settlement abilities and magic should be tied to the remnant system. Furthermore, we should allow players to 'buy' buffs from a settlement in exchange for remnants. Remnants can never be exchanged for gold, only services or buffs, regardless of which system they are used in.
  • settlements should also use a currency along the lines of food (in Japan, a 'kiko' was enough rice to feed 1 person for a year, for example). This currency is also not equatable to gold, only usable for improving a settlement. Some settlement functions output food, while others cost it. (Replaces the 'gold bars' system from Birthright)
  • settlements can have an affiliated power. This can be a spirit, demon, a powerful elemental, etc. The power grants a bonus to the settlement as a whole, as well as specific bonuses to the summoning controller (and their immediate circle). Such affiliated powers have significant effects on the alignment and disposition of a settlement, directly influencing crime/justice, cultural outlook, etc. Those who take up residence in such a settlement find themselves inexorably drawn toward an alignment complimentary to the affiliated power.
  • settlements can have permanent magic circles to bind such creatures, and provide a space to make sacrifices, offerings, etc. to appease the affiliated power.
  • if a settlement has more than one affiliated power active within it, all such affiliated powers are immediately aware of the other(s), and are immediately hostile to each other. These beings despise the notion of sharing and cooperation; they operate on the basis of deals, favors, and debts. Such conflicts can create significant unrest among the populace (who likely have no idea why they suddenly hate their neighbors).

Settlement Spells To Review / Discuss

Name School Cast Time Description
Animate Objects Transmutation Std Objects attack your foes.
Atonement Abjuration Std Removes burden of misdeeds from subject and reverses magical alignment change.
Bless Water Transmutation Std Transmutes water in a flask into Holy Water.
Blessing of the Watch Enchantment (compulsion) Std Like Bless (Cleric Spell), except it lasts 1 hour per level instead of 1 minute per level and only working in the caster's home city, specifically referring to areas under the jurisdiction of the city watch.
Commune Universal Std Deity answers one yes-or-no question/lvl.
Consecrate Evocation Std Fills area with positive energy, weakening Undead.
Control Weather Transmutation Std Changes weather in local area.
Darkness Evocation Std 20-ft. radius of supernatural shadow.
Death Ward Necromancy Std Grants bonuses against "Death" spells and negative energy.
Desecrate Evocation Std Fills area with negative energy, making undead stronger.
Enter Image Universal Std Transfers your consciousness to an object bearing your likeness.
Fire Trap Abjuration Std Opened object deals 1d4 Fire Damage + 1/lvl.
Forbiddance Abjuration Std Blocks planar travel, damages creatures of different alignment.
Hallow Evocation Std Designates location as holy.
Permanency [universal]] Std Makes certain spells permanent.
Read Weather Universal Std Forecast the weather at your location for the next 48 hours.
Silence Illusion Std Negates sound in 20-ft. radius.
Symbol of Healing Conjuration Std Triggered rune heals living creatures.
Unhallow Evocation Std Designates location as unholy.
  • crystal balls, scrying pools, magical merchant wells, etc.